Alvaro Quintero: How TikTok Shop could beat Amazon as a buying Platform

Guest Bio:

Alvaro Quintero started out as an early TikTok Shop affiliate and since then has gone on to start his own TikTok Shop agency: Viralux Media. The discussion covers the current state of TikTok Shop, strategies for brands, the importance of affiliates, and the future of live shopping. Alvaro emphasizes the need for quality content, the role of honesty in affiliate marketing, and the potential of TikTok Shop to rival Amazon as a buying platform.

Summary:

In this conversation, Alvaro Quintero discusses the evolution of social commerce, particularly focusing on TikTok Shop. He shares his journey from selling on Amazon to becoming a successful affiliate and brand owner on TikTok. The discussion covers the current state of TikTok Shop, strategies for brands, the importance of affiliates, and the future of live shopping. Alvaro emphasizes the need for quality content, the role of honesty in affiliate marketing, and the potential of TikTok Shop to rival Amazon as a buying platform.

Takeaway:

• TikTok Shop allows for first purchase profitability.
• The platform reduces friction in the buying process.
• Live shopping is still in its early stages on TikTok.
• Brands need to focus on quality content creation.
• Affiliates play a crucial role in driving sales.
• Honesty in marketing builds consumer trust.
• Big brands are starting to recognize TikTok Shop’s potential.
• Organic growth strategies are essential for success.

Full Transcript:

Moritz Schröder (00:01.974)
Hello, welcome. Welcome on the podcast. Excited to be talking to you for a number of reasons. I’ve been seeing you posting on LinkedIn predominantly about TikTok shop. You’re talking a lot about live shopping, your experience in that field as well. So I’m excited to talk with you about social commerce, where it’s at right now, especially in the US where you’re based.

but also where you see it going into the future. Maybe we can start though with getting a little bit of background on you. What got you excited about social commerce in the first place and what then made you pull the trigger and actually jump into it full time.

Alvaro – Viralux Media (00:45.25)
Yeah, so make a long story short, I’ve been selling on Amazon for about three years prior to going into social commerce. And the reason why I stopped selling on Amazon, I was doing the wholesale model. So I was buying already name brand stuff and selling it. The reason why I stopped is because the fees were getting too much for me. was in the grocery category. So was very small profit margins. And any increase in fees on Amazon will really ruin me. So that’s when I was starting to look at other business models.

And I was looking at Amazon Influencer. I was looking at TikTok Shop and KDP as well, which is just like Amazon, but you’re just print on demand for books. The best one that worked out for me was TikTok Shop affiliate. I started out as an affiliate back in March of last year, 2024, and ended up having a really big month, three months in. I did a hundred thousand dollar profit month as an affiliate. And that’s when I switched over into starting my own brand.

And we launched our first brand back in November of last year as well. it’s already a whole year, which is kind of crazy to look at, the progress that we’ve made. We did about 10 grand in sales the first month. In the second month, we did $60,000 in sales. So we scaled pretty quickly with that brand. And now we have four brands that we own. And we help shops around.

Moritz Schröder (02:02.635)
So that’s interesting to me. You have a really good month, really early on as a TikTok shop affiliate, but then you decide to not just stick with that, but actually take it a step further. What made you, you know, not just keep doing what you were already doing very successfully, obviously.

Alvaro – Viralux Media (02:20.812)
Yeah, it’s funny. I always joke around with my friends right now because the whole creator marketplace is insane. I I should have just stayed in this place because I would have made a lot more money, especially with like the retainers, the bonuses they have now. But the reason why I always just switched over to launching my own brands, because when I was doing Amazon, just in the wholesale model, everybody knows if you’re in Amazon space, everybody knows there’s there’s an arbitrage model, there’s a private label model. Then there’s those are like the only two models pretty much.

I always wanted to do a private label. just didn’t think I had enough money to do it because I knew that you need a good run rate of at least six months to a year with Amazon because you’re going to be in the negative for six months to a year. And most people can’t stand that, especially if you’re bootstrapping a brand. And with TikTok Shop, I saw the opportunity of, hey, you don’t need to burn money at all. You could be first purchase profitable, which is very hard in this economy right now. yeah, every single brand now we have is first purchase profitable. Like we’re not in the red at all.

Moritz Schröder (03:18.305)
you attribute that mainly to just how TikTok shop is set up or is that your skills, your abilities also for your clients and the brands you work with to make sure they never lose money? Is it a combination of the two? What’s the secret sauce there?

Alvaro – Viralux Media (03:35.566)
I would say it’s for sure the combination of the two. I always try not to put myself on a high pedestal just because the knowledge that I know is already out there. It’s more actually just putting the work. I like what Alex Hermosy always says. A lot of people just underestimate the amount of work people actually have to do. So I would say it’s for sure more attribution to TikTok Shop and what they were able to do with bringing videos to the buying platform. Because it’s always been a thing, but there is a lot of friction. Let’s just on Instagram.

You could have those dropshippers that post videos go viral, but then someone has to click the page, click the link, then check out. There’s a lot of points of friction. TikTok made it amazing where there’s almost no friction. The link’s right there and you could check out with Apple Pay. Amazing. Boom.

Moritz Schröder (04:17.31)
Right. And I mean, when you, we go back to when you were an affiliate making a hundred K in your third month, I think you, I think you said, didn’t you pause and say, okay, this is a gold rush here and I’m very, very early. I should just capitalize on the fact that clearly not everyone out there has yet figured this out. I should make as much money as possible.

take it to the bank and just live off the dividends by the time this goes away because clearly this is not sustainable.

Alvaro – Viralux Media (04:48.142)
Yeah, it’s funny because we could look back at stuff now and be like, oh my god, this was a gold rush. So I always tell people, whenever you’re doing something, try to step away from it just for a day or two and be like, is this worthy enough of a gold rush? Right now we look at AI, and a lot of people look at AI. I look at AI. I say there’s an AI bubble. And I’m just putting this as an analogy because let’s just say most people do remember when the market crashed back in 08. Obviously, I was a little kid. I don’t remember, but I could read history, thankfully.

So I’m like, OK, there’s a lot of similarities. So I’m like, OK, we could look at past history and compare it to now. Same thing with the Gold Rush. There’s the drop shipping Gold Rush, the Amazon FBA Gold Rush. And I do think there’s a TikTok Shop Gold Rush. At least last year when I started, I didn’t know. I needed a new business model. And I’m not really stuck on the business model. more of like, I don’t want to be right. I just want to make money. That’s always been the model I listened to.

So now looking at it, I still think there is like a really good gold rush right now on TikTok shop. Obviously it’s not as good as like the early days, even like when I started back in March, it was early, but not that early because I think it came out in late 2023.

Moritz Schröder (05:53.912)
Exactly. I think it was November.

Alvaro – Viralux Media (05:56.236)
Yeah, exactly. So I was still semi early, but I always tell myself, damn, I wish I would have just launched the brand back when I started as an affiliate. Like that would have been better.

Moritz Schröder (06:04.767)
Yeah, looking back, we’re all smarter, I mean, I remember the crash in 2008, the bubble bursting and, well, everybody thought times of stocks are over, right? And should have just doubled down, bought more and hopefully buy Apple back then. Didn’t do that.

Alvaro – Viralux Media (06:22.574)
Exactly.

Moritz Schröder (06:23.711)
Looking better, all smarter. But if we look a little bit forward, where do you think we are in this cycle? I mean, as you said, it’s been pretty much exactly two years now that we’ve had TikTok Shop in the US at least. Obviously there are a lot of markets that don’t even have TikTok Shop yet. So there’s still a lot of money to be made other where. Like Sweden, for example, where I’m based, I’m very much excited for TikTok Shop to launch here.

probably pretty soon in 2026. But if we look at the cycle that we’re in in the US, where do you think we stand? Is it still very early days? Do you see things solidifying a little bit? A lot of people leaving the game again because there’s not as much money to be made or maybe not as easily as at the very early days. What are your experiences right now?

Alvaro – Viralux Media (07:14.318)
Yeah, I think it’s still the early days, but now it’s becoming the early days of paid. Back of last year, it really wasn’t paid. When I had that really big month, there was no GMV Max, at least I think there wasn’t. You had to get Spark code. So I got my Spark code, I sent it to the brand, I was like, could you please run GMV Max? Because there was no ads. I did this organically. I was like, could you please run ads? Because obviously I want to make more money. And the brand messaged me back, was like, hey, we’re packing orders, we’re slammed. If we get to it, we get to it. And I was like, OK, cool, I understand, no worries.

And it’s funny because now everything’s ads on TikTok. If you’re not running ads, you’re pretty much fighting uphill battle. That’s what I always say. But the nice thing is it’s growing so much to the point where the marketplace is good for any brand now. Back in the day, everybody used to say that, hey, my price point’s too high. Now we’re seeing, obviously, the ninjas, the $200 price point just really crushing it. Facebook just got on. MEDA just got on. And that’s very interesting to me because I’ve always said that I think

TikTok will be Amazon as a buying platform, which sounds crazy to say, right? Insane. But it sounds insane to say that OpenAI could replace Google as a search engine. And now we’re honestly having that conversation, right? So I also think that we’ll start having that conversation of like, TikTok could replace Amazon as a buying platform. And the only reason I say that is because Amazon’s not a buying platform. I don’t think it’s a marketplace. It’s more a fulfillment company. They really master fulfillment. I don’t think no one’s going to ever beat them in fulfillment. And that’s why think TikTok has to partner up with them, which they supposedly were.

But right now, TikTok Shop has like the three day shipping, which I don’t think is that great because me as a consumer, I buy on Amazon every single day. If it doesn’t arrive same day, I do not order it, which is really dumb because when you think about it, if it doesn’t arrive today, I’m not going to order it. I’m just going to order it for tomorrow for same day shipping, but I could have just ordered it today for tomorrow delivery. It’s just, yeah, it’s just funny. But I think Amazon’s a fulfillment company. think TikTok will win as a marketplace.

Moritz Schröder (09:04.733)
Yeah, and also for the older people listening, we do remember when Amazon was frowned upon, right? Amazon used to be this, well, originally bookstore only, right? And then they slowly got into DVDs, they got into other stuff, but for a long time, it was looked down upon as this place where you buy very cheap.

possibly rip off or replica stuff from China and over time it got more established as a place where you could find anything, where you get same day delivery and where people go to shop.

period. And I think TikTok is going through that same evolution where at the very early stages, everybody’s kind of sneering at it and thinking, okay, the stuff that you see there and the stuff that you can buy there really not worth my time. And as a brand, you might feel like it’s not worth your effort, but slowly but surely you get to a place where more and more reputable brands get on it and really pave the way for everyone else.

Alvaro – Viralux Media (09:40.461)
Yeah.

Alvaro – Viralux Media (10:04.374)
Yeah, exactly.

Moritz Schröder (10:07.261)
When we talk about a little bit about the brands that you now work for and that you help get onto a TikTok shop, I know every brand is different and I’m sure they’re eager to assure you that they are different and what works for one brand doesn’t work for the other brand. But I’m sure there’s a little bit of a recipe that you’re applying, a formula that you know is tried and true and that you can.

Alvaro – Viralux Media (10:24.215)
you

Yeah.

Moritz Schröder (10:35.302)
possibly get very good results with for any brand. Can you walk us a little bit through what you see work right now and also maybe how that has evolved over time already?

Alvaro – Viralux Media (10:45.868)
Yeah, I think right now we’re in a learning phase. I say that just because it work, like even a couple months ago, it’s not really working now. Not saying that it won’t work, it will work, but I just, I always try to look at like what’s going to be like the maximize return. So especially with TikTok shop, everything’s always changing, which is amazing because if you’re in the space every single day, you’re going to learn it. I would say in the early stages or even like a couple months ago, just sending out samples would work. You would just need an outreach bot like UPTK, Euka, Reacher.

And you’ll be fine with that because you get sample requests and boom. And maybe as a founder, you make one video, it blows up. Now you really need volume, which is tough because one, you can’t control the type of quality that gets posted because you can’t tell exactly what the affiliate’s will post. That’s why right now we’re focused a lot on in-house content, which is why we’re doing the live stream, for example. We’re doing the stream to views. So we’re focusing on in-house content just because to.

A lot of brands are amazing, right? Even brands that aren’t doing great numbers on TikTok Shop are amazing brands. Their products are great, but no one knows they exist. So they need to be seen. And you think if they send out 1,000 samples, they’ll get seen. It’s not really like that, because I could post 1,000 videos of one single brand, and they could be horrible videos, right? So that’s where it comes into play where you need volume, but you also need quality. And it’s very hard to get the two. And I think the easiest way right now is doing it in-house, which we’ve seen most brands do now. And yeah, and I think.

Livestream is amazing for it whenever I talk to founders always tell them you could go live if you’re packing orders go live talk to your customers People love that connection

Moritz Schröder (12:18.78)
When you say keeping things in-house, how do you then think about the affiliates that you work with as a brand and as an agency? Obviously there’s a huge demand for UGC content, but at the same time, there’s quite a limited amount of affiliates that are really able to deliver on promises and pull in big numbers. How do you reach out for affiliates for your agency, for the brands you work with and that you represent? How do you make sure that you win the best

affiliates out there.

Alvaro – Viralux Media (12:50.414)
Yeah. We always use the outreach bot, like I mentioned, but we also message them on the front end. So whenever we send out a sample, the stat I’m always proud about is that every sample we send out, we get at least three videos posted. I need to check it. We always get updated weekly updates. for every sample we send out, we get three videos, which is great, because they’re only obligated to post one. And the videos are great. Now, we try to maximize as much videos as we get per sample. We don’t really try to maximize how many samples we send out.

Now, if we could do both, amazing. But if I have to pick one, I’m always going to pick the other one because it’s just better return for us as a brand. Because let’s just say your cost of goods is $10. And then your shipping is $5. It’s $15 for one video posted versus $15 for three videos posted. Right?

Moritz Schröder (13:36.677)
Yeah, it makes a lot of sense. Is that common practice? Do you see a lot of other agencies do that already or is that something that you kind of spearheaded? Because honestly, it’s not something that I’ve come across so far.

Alvaro – Viralux Media (13:50.958)
I would say it’s not that common just because as a brand owner, as an agency, they always expect that if an affiliate makes a sale, they’re going to keep posting, which you’re 100 % right. But I would love to get the stat, and I should probably try to run these numbers myself, on the sheer amount of samples we sent out, how many people have not made a sale from their first video, and they still post again. Because that’s what you want, right? You want those people, you want the determined affiliates. hey, this video didn’t work. That’s fine. Let me try it again. Versus posting one video, didn’t work. That’s it. I’m done with the product.

Because now your product is just sitting in the room doing nothing. And you don’t want that, right? You want it to get posted. So I would say it’s probably not common, just because most brands do get sales probably on that first video. But if you’re a brand in the cold start phase, this will be your best friend.

Moritz Schröder (14:34.859)
And how do you make sure that the affiliates that you reach out to are as good as you can possibly get for that brand, especially if you’re a brand that is new to TikTok shop, you might not have a household name yet. You’re trying to establish that obviously, but you need the affiliates to do that. So it’s a little bit of a catch 22 there, right? How do you break that cycle?

Alvaro – Viralux Media (15:00.718)
Yeah. So it’s funny. always tell brand owners that someone that has never made a piece of content and the top 1 % affiliates on TikTok shop have a lot of things in common in making content, right? Because the person that has never made a piece of content, they’re a consumer. They know exactly what they want. They just have to show it on camera. Versus like the top 1%, they know how to show it on camera. So it’s literally just knowing how to show it on camera. That’s why I love betting on like the smaller affiliates, even if they just say they only have a couple of videos posted.

It’s all about the post rate for me. I don’t look too much at the GMV. And unless they have an account that has been posting every single day for the past couple months, then I have to account for the GMV. And these are all metrics that TikTok Shop gives you on the back end. it shows you the revenue they generated in the last 30 days. It shows you their post rate. And now they have a sample score. And that’s just a number they make up. I forgot where they get it from. But it just shows you it’s like 0 to 100 if they’re going to post your video or not. And the nice thing is too is that

They also have reviews. We never left a review for an affiliate because I just think it’s a waste of time. But there’s reviews there if you wanted to.

Moritz Schröder (16:07.236)
Do you factor those in manually or do you have tools that you use to actually analyze all that data? Because I assume that you have quite a large pool of affiliates that you work with, right? It seems unreasonable to actually sift through those numbers one by one. Do you have any tool that you can recommend to other people who are looking to build their own affiliate network?

Alvaro – Viralux Media (16:29.11)
Yeah, so we use Uptick. It’s been a great tool, and it also does outreach as well. They’ve been updating it almost every single month now, and it has great metrics there, too.

Moritz Schröder (16:39.181)
What else is part of your tech stack? Since we’re on that topic, do you have a number of tools that you use every single day, every single week? I know there are a couple of out there that probably everyone is aware of like FastMos, but what other tools maybe fly a little bit under the radar still that you can tell everyone about?

Alvaro – Viralux Media (17:00.206)
I would always say ever since last year, even ever since I was an affiliate, I never really used like fastmars or something like that. I would always say the best tool is TikTok itself, right? Like you just go on TikTok and it shows you right there because if you’re on your TikTok profile, TikTok is viewing you as a consumer. So it’s going to feed you what you want and what it thinks you want, right? So you’ll be able to see like, okay, this video is getting pushed out for a specific reason. Why is it getting pushed out? Right? So yeah, besides that, obviously I use the basics. use Gemini.

Not a big fan of Chai GPT no more, so I use Gemini for all the basics. Claude’s the best for copy, so if you want to make any scripts for your creator brief, Claude’s going to be amazing for that.

Moritz Schröder (17:39.81)
How much do you actually brief your affiliates? Is that something where you just feel like, they’re the creatives, they know what they do best and let them just run with it? Or do you try to give them pretty strict guidelines and railways to make sure they don’t go too much off script?

Alvaro – Viralux Media (17:56.95)
Yeah, I try not to be too strict just because I feel like that’s when you start limiting the creativity. For us, I’ve been trying to see like when’s a good time to update the brief. I would say a couple months ago, we used to update every single week just because there’s videos going viral every single week and I want people to be up to date. Now I’m more trying to update it every other week just so people actually have time to look at it. But I think something that most briefs are missing are just having the don’ts. Everybody says the do’s, like do this, do this, do this, and it’ll work. You should include the don’ts as well because

They don’t know what not to do if that makes sense, especially for your brand specifically. Now, obviously, the basics are always there. Don’t mention weight, right? But maybe there’s something specific with your product that maybe as a brand, you don’t want it to be shown. So I think that’s something that a lot of briefs are missing whenever I’m looking at them.

Moritz Schröder (18:41.13)
And when you think about the don’ts, is it a lot, like you just mentioned, maybe brand guidelines, things that are relevant for their specific industry or niche, or do you also give them don’ts in terms of like how they actually produce the content, how to script their content? Is their full creativity allowed or are there brands that are very particular about how they want their affiliates to talk about their brand?

Alvaro – Viralux Media (19:10.374)
I’ve seen both. I’ve seen brands that let the affiliates roam free, and I’ve seen brands as well like, hey, I don’t want this video posted. And I always tell them, mean, one, you can’t control what they post. You could say, hey, take this down, and they could make 100 more videos exactly like it, especially if it’s working, right? Just recently, we’ve been seeing the founder of Knobs. So it’s a toothpaste. And he always says that he hates bottom of funnel because it just takes up all his GNV mags and stuff like that. But if you’re an affiliate and it’s making you money,

you’re going to make it, right? It doesn’t matter if the founder’s telling you not to make it. You’re still going to make it because it’s making you money and TikTok is favoring you in the algorithm, right? So it’s always like, it’s very hard to decide, especially as a founder, because you don’t want someone to be like, hey, it’s free, it’s free, it’s free. And it takes up all your budget every single day. It doesn’t feel right. But the way I look at it, as long as it’s selling, it makes that brand awareness. And it gives you that spillover to obviously Shopify and to Amazon.

Moritz Schröder (20:02.552)
It’s interesting that you say some brands might not even like the bottom of funnel content because it might convert too much. What’s the reasoning there? I mean, I would assume as a brand, sure, you maybe want some top of the funnel content as well, but if it makes you money, everybody wins, right?

Alvaro – Viralux Media (20:11.79)
you

Alvaro – Viralux Media (20:23.01)
Yeah. His specific reason was that they were just lying, which is true. I’m not going to disagree with them. If someone’s saying that you buy one, you get three free and they’re lying. And it’s like, your budgets going to that video? One, it’s still making sales, right? But obviously he was saying that he would get message on messages on his customer support saying like, Hey, it said buy one, get one, get three free. I did not receive my three free ones. What’s the problem? And that’s where it becomes like an issue in my opinion, which is tough. I know he’s been talking to tick tock about it. full respect to him. Obviously not trying to talk bad about him, but it’s just interesting because

Moritz Schröder (20:28.447)
Okay.

Alvaro – Viralux Media (20:52.92)
like I mentioned, it’s very hard to control what these affiliates post. The only way to control it is not to have an open collaboration and only decide to work with these 10 affiliates because you know they’re going to produce a type of content that you want as a brand.

Moritz Schröder (21:08.032)
Yeah, can, okay, now I can see where he’s coming from if they’re just making false claims and promises. I also see how that’s super tempting for the affiliates to go down that route, especially if maybe this is just a quick money grab on the side for them. It’s not something that they try to do sustainably and actually make a living off of. How would anyone control that? I can totally see how.

Alvaro – Viralux Media (21:10.733)
Yeah.

Moritz Schröder (21:33.257)
It’s also an issue of who takes responsibility, right? I mean, you’re the agency, they’re the brand, you have the affiliate, then you have TikTok on top of that. And then the customer turns obviously to the brand, but they might be the least capable to control this. Who in the end would be able to control that?

Alvaro – Viralux Media (21:50.35)
I know TikTok has been doing some measures just because I have some friends that send me screenshots like, hey, this video got taken down. So I’m like, oh, OK, that’s good and bad. I’m saying good just because, actually, because their claim is misleading. So if your video is misleading, then they’re going to take it down, which is good. But at the end of the day, it’s just AI. So it’s just a person looking at the video. So it could be wrong most of the time. But I know TikTok is taking measures because if you’re saying this is going to cure cancer, for example, it’s not going to do that, right? So you shouldn’t mislead people in that route.

Moritz Schröder (21:56.784)
Hahaha

Alvaro – Viralux Media (22:19.03)
Especially because it’s so easy to mislead people in this generation, in my opinion.

Moritz Schröder (22:23.681)
Yeah, definitely seems that way. Alvaro.

You’re working with a ton of affiliates. You mentioned that there are some that are just the top tier and you know for a fact that they’re gonna convert so much better than the bottom 90%. How do you choose those? How do you find those? Do they have common traits that you can see over and over that just work well with TikTok and the format itself? Or is that also changing like the seasons?

Things just change, trends change, and an affiliate that is making 100k this month might be not making any money next month.

Alvaro – Viralux Media (23:03.298)
The nice thing with being an affiliate is if you’re a good affiliate, you’re always going to be good, in my opinion, just because you have the optionality of products versus as a brand owner. You don’t have the optionality of switching your SKUs, SKU economics. If you decided on launching this product, you have to live through the bad and the good versus the affiliates. I’m not saying that most of them don’t because I do know some affiliates are loyal to some brands, which is amazing. But you don’t have to be. You could decide that, hey, this brand is not making any sales. Let me switch over to this brand.

this brand’s not making any sales. Let me switch over to the competitor. And I see it every single day. So I think if you’re in a good affiliate, you’re always going to be making good money as long as you’re testing out different products. Now, as a brand owner, that’s when you have to decide, OK, maybe I’m positioning my brand the wrong way. Because with every single brand on TikTok, it could be advertised in multiple different ways. And whenever they find a winning angle, they always just stick with it.

forever, pretty much. They never really switch up. And the ones that do switch up are the ones that are always doing great. For example, NeuroGum, they’re always going to be doing great because they have different angles, and they’re always promoting at different angles. So I think not being stuck to one single angle for your product, especially because if you decide on the product, you already have a ton of units in the 3PL or in your warehouse, you need to get rid of them, right? Because you want the cash to be flowing. So I think finding the top affiliates gets a lot easier if you’re promoting your product the right way.

Moritz Schröder (24:29.459)
So you need to make sure that there’s a match between the product, the brand and the affiliate you’re working with. On the other hand, I do hear people saying, okay, affiliate should actually stick to the niche. They should be true to a couple of brands or at least an industry that they work with to make sure that they’re not.

burning the viewers and the subscribers that they have. Subscribers don’t matter as much as they used to five or 10 years ago when it was still YouTube days. Everybody was chasing the subscriber number, right? Clearly that is no longer as relevant, but you still to some extent want to stay true to the audience that you have built over time. How much can an affiliate actually switch?

Alvaro – Viralux Media (24:56.492)
Yeah.

Moritz Schröder (25:15.925)
products, niches, industries, and how much should they be loyal to one area.

Alvaro – Viralux Media (25:22.702)
I think they should be testing out a ton of products as long as they’re not being disingenuous, right? I’ve seen really top affiliates just be honest, whether it’s actually good. And they’re like, hey, I haven’t tried it, but I just tried it on. I like it so far. Then that goes viral. It’s funny because just today I was seeing this one top affiliate. Her video came up. I looked at the comments, and they were saying, this same woman told me that this product does the same thing. So the consumers do catch on, especially because that comment had like,

400 likes, which is a lot of people agreeing with her. So I think as an affiliate, especially as a top affiliate, you should be aware that your image is being used, whether you think about it or not. And it could be in a bad way or in a good way. So I think just being honest, not saying, this has cured me. This also has cured me for the same problem. So just being honest pays off in the long run. And you do have a point that followers don’t matter too much. But I think now it matters a little bit, because we know some of the top, top affiliates.

already have like a personal brand, right? People like buying from them because they know they’re going to be honest and they’re not going to promote something that doesn’t work. And we see a lot, especially on X, I always see affiliates saying, I’m not going to, like, I got the sample and they also paid me a retainer, but I’m not going to post it. I’d rather send them the money back rather than posting it and just lying to the final consumer, right? Which is, I respect it, right? Because especially now in my opinion, we’re like a big inflation with affiliates, right? Especially with retainers and everything, there’s affiliates earning crazy amounts of money, which I love.

But being able to be like, hey, I don’t want to promote this because it probably doesn’t work. And not allowing yourself to earn from that is, I give it respect.

Moritz Schröder (26:58.964)
Yeah, it’s interesting that honesty and trust actually becomes valuable again. It seemed for a short while that we’re post that we’re in an era where nothing matters anymore. It’s all about the hook. It’s all about great visuals. It’s all about how effectively you can sell a product. And it seems like we’ve

kind of circled back around and decided, hey, actually I do care that I can trust this person. I do care as a consumer that this person seems relatable and also tells me straight up if he doesn’t like something. So if you say that there are these creators and affiliates that actually send products back, they’re not bad mouthing the company that sent them the products, but at the same time, they’re being fair and honest to their clients and to the audience as well.

Alvaro – Viralux Media (27:51.553)
Exactly.

Moritz Schröder (27:53.747)
Yeah, that’s nice to hear. And it’s interesting to hear from people like you who are really working behind the scenes. As someone who’s using TikTok like me, I only see the content, right? I don’t or very rarely get to hear what’s happening behind closed doors, but it’s great to hear that these people exist who actually then send back products. How would you, yeah, go ahead.

Alvaro – Viralux Media (28:15.758)
Yeah, I think what’s helping it too is these big brands hopping on the platform already, right? Because I can’t tell a lie about Meta. Everybody knows the Meta Ray Bans, right? Everybody knows what they do. I could just showcase what they do, maybe in a different way that hasn’t been portrayed. But I can’t lie and say they turn you into an AI. Because everybody knows the company already. So with these bigger brands hopping on the platform, I think it’s better for everybody because it builds that trust within the platform itself. Like you mentioned before, everybody thought it was just

some Chinese drop shipping for TikTok. Now it’s like really big brands hopping on the platform, which is amazing.

Moritz Schröder (28:51.933)
Do you see those giant companies do anything differently than the smaller ones that were populating TikTok shop before? Are they more careful? Are they willing to spend more or less? Are they very hesitant with working with unknown affiliates? Like what’s their verdict on the platform so far?

Alvaro – Viralux Media (29:12.876)
Yeah, I think now they’re getting on the platform because they see the potential versus back then they’re like, okay, there, there is a potential, but there’s no proof of it yet. Now they see brands that just launched doing a couple million a month, which is insane because some brands take five, 10, 20 years to actually get some real numbers. And they’re in the red for the five first five years. Right. There’s, know some, I know some founders that just launched last year and they’re already doing four or 5 million a month right now, which is insane, right? Insane growth. So I think now they see the upside and there’s proof on the platform.

I would always say, don’t know why these big brands don’t hop on the platform, but it’s because there’s no proof yet. Why put time and effort, especially because it takes a lot of time, and that’s what’s more valuable to the company rather than, hey, we could just add an extra $100,000 into Meta versus putting $100,000 into TikTok, and maybe there’s no upside. They know there’s upside on Meta because the amount of money you could spend is pretty much uncapped, unlike TikTok. Right now, it’s still pretty capped. I don’t know how much the big spenders are spending, but I think it’s maybe around $50,000 a day on GMV Max compared to…

Metal is very different, right? It’s a very small scale.

Moritz Schröder (30:15.175)
Right, right. Do you know how those giant companies are finding their way to TikTok shop?

Do they have agencies they actually work with or do they do it all in-house? I would imagine if you’re meta selling Ray-Ban glasses, it takes a lot to go out and actually trust a TikTok shop agency that has been around for maximum two years because that’s how all TikTok shop is in the U.S. to then basically own everything of that sales channel, right? I could imagine that TikTok, that meta actually decides, okay, we’re gonna do everything in-house.

house. At the same time, there are probably not a lot of people equipped enough at Meta to then take a giant company like Meta onto TikTok shop. How does that look like?

Alvaro – Viralux Media (31:06.22)
Yeah, I would take the assumption that they for sure hired in-house. just gave a really good salary to a few people and they’re just running their TikTok shop. as far as like the little bit smaller brands, just say any brand that’s maybe 10 to $50 million a year. They, I’ve seen those brands partner up with agencies because now certain agencies are starting to offer TikTok shops. know like coming from Amazon space, I know certain agencies from Amazon space and they’re starting to offer like TikTok shop services, which is not too hard. And it’s a lot easier to make TikTok shop work when you already have a foundation outside of TikTok.

Whether they see you in Target, whether they see you on Amazon, whether they see you on other platforms. It’s a lot easier. Every founder I know, they launched primarily on TikTok. So they’re a TikTok shop native brand, which is a lot harder now doing that compared to last year. Because now you’re competing with brands that already have presence on Amazon, already have presence on Shopify. And making presence on TikTok is pretty easy when they’re like, hey, I think I’ve seen this product before. Let me see. Versus a product they’ve never seen before. The first time they’re seeing it is on TikTok shop.

And people still have that connotation of TikTok shop, like pretty cheap platform. It’s switching a little bit just recently, I’d say.

Moritz Schröder (32:12.817)
I certainly agree with that. mean, if I see a brand name that is familiar or product that I already know, I’m much more inclined to, you know, take the next step and actually buy from them.

On the other hand, I totally see how a TikTok shop native brand has advantages in the sense that they can actually produce products that do really well in video, right? I mean, something like Ray-Ban glasses, I would assume just don’t natively do very well on TikTok shop videos because it’s very hard to showcase what they can actually do, right? Whereas if you have a super viral product that you’re launching exclusively for TikTok shop,

that’s so much easier as an affiliate to then promote.

Alvaro – Viralux Media (32:58.251)
Exactly.

Moritz Schröder (33:00.632)
Yeah, it’s going to be super interesting how that plays out. mean, we’ve seen those viral products come up, but I think we’ve seen nothing yet. I think it’s a very early stages and it’s going to be cool to see where this goes. If we talk a little bit about GMV Max, I mean, that’s a fairly new development that now everyone is forced to use GMV Max. How did you experience that shift? maybe can you give a quick one, two minute.

Alvaro – Viralux Media (33:14.807)
Agreed.

Moritz Schröder (33:30.178)
summary of how GMV Max actually works for the brands that you work with.

Alvaro – Viralux Media (33:35.03)
Yeah, so one thing I always tell people is you need volume to GMV Max for the work, right? I always say at least wait until you have 100 videos posted of your brand, right? I always try to downsize everything. Whenever I’m talking to a new brand, just try to have 100 videos posted. Try at least post 10 videos a day. Try to send out 100 samples the first month. But in terms of just GMV Max, I think it’s good that’s making people use it just because I like the economics of it.

You don’t have to worry about media buying or anything like that. You just focus on videos posted. That’s a formula of JVMax. Videos posted equals JVMax. And obviously, videos posted, they have to be quality videos. But to get to quality, you just have to go through enough quantity, is what I always say. So yeah, for us, for our biggest brand, we try to post at least 100 videos a day. Not obviously in-house, but just in the ecosystem of our affiliates, we try to get at least 100 videos posted a day.

Because for us to get the return we want on GMV Max, that’s the number we need to we need to hit. Which obviously is pretty easy compared to the really big brands posting probably thousands of videos a day.

Moritz Schröder (34:39.13)
how easy is that formula to then be true? mean, you have a number of videos that you’re going for, but, sorry, but.

You can’t be sure that that will then actually convert into the GMV that probably the brand is hoping for. How do the two get together and how do you as an agency ensure that the brand actually gets out of the campaign what they are hoping for?

Alvaro – Viralux Media (35:11.214)
Yeah, I would say there’s for sure indirect returns that we don’t see. I think now GMV Max doesn’t account for organic sales. But the way we get it is because let’s just say we get an average three videos posted per sample sent out. So that means we need to send out at least 30 samples a day, because that means we’ll get 90 videos posted, right? So like 33 samples a day every single day. So we need to for sure send out 33 samples every single day. If we’re not doing that, then we’re not going to get to the 100 videos posted.

Then if we’re sending that out, that’s only for the sample sent out. What about the affiliate that we sent out a sample last month, but they’re still with us because they’re making great money, right? So we’re still over that 100 videos posted. So that’s the way we do it, to be honest. It might not be the best way, but it’s the way that’s been working for us.

Moritz Schröder (35:52.463)
It’s so interesting that it’s possible to break it down to these pretty clear formulas where you have.

clear numbers of how many samples you need to send out that trickles down to how many videos you’re getting per day. And that trickles down to the GMV that you can hope for. I think that makes it in a way very predictable and certainly easier as an agency to predict what you can guarantee your clients. Is that fair to say?

Alvaro – Viralux Media (36:25.974)
Yeah, I always think about it like

Alex Hormozzi says, you can’t tell someone be nicer. What does be nicer mean? I can’t tell one of my clients, hey, we’re going to make more cells. What does make more cells mean? So there has to be action set in place. So if we want to make more cells, that means we need to send out more samples because samples can turn into cells. But why do samples turn into cells? Samples turn into cells because when someone gets a sample, they post a video. Then they post a video, it gets views. And from that views, it gets a conversion. So now you all know your conversion rate. from that, you could just work backwards the way I look at it.

So it’s very easy to say, want to make more sales. Very easy to say, be nicer. But what does that mean? Is where I look at it.

Moritz Schröder (37:03.67)
And with that formula, how do you factor live shopping into this? Is it a major factor for you? Is it something that you don’t do with every brand or is it something that for you, at least as an agency, is a must for any brand that wants to work with you?

Alvaro – Viralux Media (37:09.655)
Yeah, so

Alvaro – Viralux Media (37:20.75)
No, I always tell people that it’s not needed, but if you could do it yourself, do it 100%, especially because there’s so many times a brand could go live that they’re not going live. For example, the easiest part is fulfillment. We’re seeing it now. There’s a lot of companies now that there’s packing orders going live. That’s amazing. For example, base body works. I think they’re live 20 hours a day and they’re just like packing orders, doing giveaways. That’s amazing. Anytime you could double dip. I love the idea because now you’re double dipping. So now you have, so you’re paying someone to ship out orders, but they’re also going live.

Amazing. I don’t think it’s needed. think the live selling is very early on TikTok shops, still very early, which is funny because back when I started out as an affiliate back in March of 2024, I started out the first month, I only did live streams. That’s the only thing I did. I do a single video, just live streams. But I still think it’s very early. But it’s funny because Meta is actually going live. They’re going live every single day, I think. Just because you don’t get the direct returns, right?

Most brands do not get direct returns. see the big brands, obviously, they have a mega live, crazy numbers. But on average, you’re not going to get a direct return with how much you’re paying either an agency or how much you’re paying someone to go live. That’s why I always tell people, just start off, you go in live, build up the foundation. I think as a whole, live selling, think it’s great. We’ve been implementing whatnot on our live streams just so we could get some revenue per hour. And it’s been helping out a good amount.

Moritz Schröder (38:40.686)
And for me that’s really cool to hear that there are different ways of live streaming. You don’t have to have the fancy setup. You don’t have to have a professional host. can…

Just film what you’re doing in the company. can show people in the warehouse packing orders and people would actually be willing to watch that and not only that, they would be willing to actually buy more because you’re showing that and you’re explaining things as you go. So it is converting surprisingly, I think five years ago, probably very few people would have predicted that. And it’s cool to see people experiment that with that. What are some creative ways that you have seen brands utilize live streaming?

Alvaro – Viralux Media (39:21.08)
I’ve seen the David Bar. They were going up to people on the street and just, I think, giving bars away. And they were live streaming. Amazing, because now you can record videos and also live stream. The packing the orders is the very unique way that almost every brand is doing that, which is great. Omni channel streaming is something that I don’t think multiple brands have utilized, which we’ve been doing a good amount. But now Goalie, for example, they’re on whatnot. I think they’re live right now. But they did their first stream, I think, couple weeks ago or a couple of days ago.

And it’s insane because for a brand like goalie, we know how massive they are at this point. They just want to take up as much market share as possible. Right. And whatnot’s huge. have friends doing amazing numbers on their second, third, fourth month already on the platform. But I would say whatnot it’s still very early for branded live stream. So it’s very early for brands specifically, especially if you don’t have multiple skews. If you’re a single skew brand, it’s going to be very hard for you to succeed on whatnot. But if you’re already going live on tick tock might as well turn out that one out stream because it

gives you the opportunity to add more revenue per hour. And that’s the only thing that matters in my opinion, because let’s just say, for example, if you’re paying an agency 100 bucks an hour and you get back $100 in revenue, it’s worth it because you’re that brand awareness. And the biggest thing that TikTok live streams are helpful for is customer service. It’s eight plus customer service, as long as your host knows what they’re talking about. Because if someone wants to buy your product and they’re like, heads and tails, if they ask a question on a video, there’s a 90 % chance it’s never going to get answered.

versus they click the product, they see the brand is live, they click the live stream, like, hey, does this work with this? Then the host could answer right away and it converts right there. But I think if they still add it to cart from their video, it’s going to count as a video, so not a live stream. So it’s very hard to track like those type of things, but customer service is worth 100%.

Moritz Schröder (41:05.825)
Have you seen those pictures from China where people are live selling and they have, I think, 30 different phones attached to a giant holder that live streams to all these different platforms that exist in China? I think that might be the future of the Western world as well very soon.

Alvaro – Viralux Media (41:20.631)
Yeah.

Alvaro – Viralux Media (41:24.819)
Which is the same to say. If you tell anybody this like 10 years ago, insane.

Moritz Schröder (41:30.228)
Yeah, totally. And it’s interesting to see that Wotnot is allowing brands now to sell. I actually wasn’t fully aware of that, that Goalie is doing that. From what I know, they have been very focused on collectibles, right? But it seems like they also see other ways to make money. So why not branch out?

Alvaro – Viralux Media (41:52.386)
Yeah, I think right now they’re big on liquidations because that’s what my friends are doing. trying to see if they’re, I think they’re live right now. Sorry, I’m just trying to pull it up. I think I bookmarked your stream. It says today at 1.30, but they’re not live yet. But as you can see, have their live stream right there. And they’re doing auctions, is like what Wotnod is. Wotnod’s still not like a, you can do buy it now, but the reason Wotnod does so great is because it’s auction. So you’re competing versus someone else on the screen, then you’re competing versus like a

another 100 people trying to buy the same product. So I think it’s very interesting. I think it’s good for, like I mentioned, market share. And if you get revenue per hour, that’s pretty much all that matters for these type of brands. It’s not really the product profit per hour. I would say profit per hour, you’re still very in the red. But market share and revenue per hour is worth it 100%.

Moritz Schröder (42:40.481)
Yeah.

Yeah, and as we just said, it’s very, very early days, right? I mean, you have whatnot jumping on this now in a different way than they have up until now.

But then you still have YouTube shopping. You have Twitch lately going into that direction, allowing to sell live. But then you also have Meta probably making a push into that direction again after they discontinued it a couple of years ago. It’s going to be so interesting to see what live shopping we’ll be able to deliver in the next couple of years.

Alvaro – Viralux Media (43:16.96)
Exactly. Yeah. I’m for sure interested. It’s funny because when people see like, when people see Tik Tok, they weren’t the first person to do like live shopping, right? There’s always people that have done it before, but I always say like sometimes just too early to the market. It’s just very hard.

Moritz Schröder (43:31.059)
Yeah. And maybe they also lacked the experience that now TikTok and ByteDance clearly have from the Chinese market. It’s probably what happened when Meta launched this, right? They saw it working in China and they figured, we have the largest platform in the West. We can just roll this out and basically dominate the market the same way it happened in China with other brands and platforms.

It turned out it was not as easy as they maybe thought it would be. also adoption was just not there, right? People were not familiar with this format and it took something like TikTok and their continued effort to educate the consumers that social shopping is actually a game changer for a lot of brands and it’s here to stay.

Alvaro – Viralux Media (44:19.266)
Yeah, exactly.

Moritz Schröder (44:22.368)
We had a pretty wild 2025, I think. It’s November, it’s end of November. So I feel like it’s fair to recap a little bit. The year started with TikTok basically being banned. I think in the U.S. it was down for about 10 hours. Is that correct? Before it went live again and then Trump.

Alvaro – Viralux Media (44:40.61)
Yeah, I think so.

Moritz Schröder (44:46.341)
Made it happen that TikTok was able to stay live, continue to work as intended. And I’m sure a lot of people, and you included, were very happy who are making their living with TikTok Shop at this point. Where do you see TikTok Shop go from here in the US and the rest of the world? Do you have any predictions for the coming year?

Alvaro – Viralux Media (45:08.204)
Yeah, I always like making bold claims. So like I mentioned earlier, I think TikTok shop will be Amazon as a buying platform. And yeah, I think that’s why I see at least not maybe not in the near future because that’s going to take a lot of time because Amazon’s huge. But for example, TikTok just be eBay sales for Q3, I believe, or it was very close. I think it was like pretty much same numbers and same, right? Compared to eBay. They’ve been around for so long. So yeah, I would say that’s the prediction I have for it. I

do believe on and take talk shop a lot because it’s still so early right so doesn’t really matter how much budget you have you can have infinite money as we see meta pretty much infinite money for the e-commerce space doesn’t mean you’re always going to succeed right because there’s no bigger brands and meta on tick tock shops specifically now they just hopped on so now we maybe we could recap it and six months into a year and see is meta the top brand on tick tock I don’t think it will be the top brand on tick tock and the year

Moritz Schröder (46:03.998)
It would be kind of ironic though, if out of all the companies, Meta would be the one that is dominating TikTok shop. And even though they can’t beat TikTok in their game, they decided to join them and make money that way. In the end, they always going to find a way to make money, right?

Alvaro – Viralux Media (46:11.534)
That would be pretty funny.

Alvaro – Viralux Media (46:22.764)
Yeah, that’s their form of winning I would say.

Moritz Schröder (46:26.439)
Yeah, exactly. If you can’t beat them, join them. For you and your agency specifically, what’s your plan for the coming future? Which trends do you try to ride? What trends do you want to double down on? Which trends do you maybe see fade away a little bit? Do you have anything that you want to focus your entire energy and resources on in 2026?

Alvaro – Viralux Media (46:52.044)
Yeah, I would say in 2026, I for sure want to focus more on organic, especially in the world where everybody’s so focused on AI, which granted I am doing AI content, right? We have a whole team doing AI content on and off shop. I still think organic is the best and we see it by the share of numbers. And that’s why I would say I’m focusing a lot more for next year. So for example, live stream, the street interviews, just giving the opportunity of being a creator to a lot of people that are great creators. They just don’t know it yet.

And that’s what I’m the biggest fan of. just real organic people, right? Because at the end of the day, you’re always going to tell AI video, which might get harder in next six months if you’re able to tell a real from a fake. But yeah, I think just really doubling down on organic and live streams.

Moritz Schröder (47:37.34)
And as an agency owner, how do you normally find your customers? How do they find you? Is it that you keep posting yourself like you do on LinkedIn, I know, and then you have brands reach out to you? Are you going to a lot of fairs and industry events? What’s the best way for you, but also other agency owners that might be listening to this to find clients?

Alvaro – Viralux Media (48:02.766)
Yeah, my best way currently has been just word of the mouth, right? It just trickles down, which that just comes from delivering great services. So obviously that always should be your number one. But LinkedIn’s amazing. Social media is amazing. As a founder of an agency or just a brand, you should always be posting on social media. Put time and effort into it every single day, because that’s your highest leverage. That’s pretty much just marketing, right? You can make an amazing product, but if no one knows about it, you can have an amazing service. No one knows about it. It doesn’t really matter.

So I think putting time every single day into content, whether that’s posting on X, which is great as well, but I think LinkedIn is probably one of the best, and going live on TikTok. Even if you’re not doing TikTok shop, you can go live on TikTok as a service founder, as an actual founder, and just talk. People love that. People love communicating.

Moritz Schröder (48:45.481)
And do you go back and forth then with potential customers in your live streams, actually helping them out, figure out problems, offering the solutions that your agency is able to provide, or do you educate them? Like what kind of style do you feel works best to then acquire customers for your agency eventually?

Alvaro – Viralux Media (49:07.916)
Yeah, it’s funny. always reference Alex Hermosy a lot. But he always says that no one has secret sauce, which I do believe. I just think that people always downplay the amount of sheer volume that is needed for something to work. And sometimes people just don’t want to do certain things. And that’s why there’s agencies. Because I truly believe all information is out there. If you really want to do it, it is out there. But sometimes you want to focus strictly on meta, and you don’t want to focus on TikTok shop. Well, there’s an agency for that.

So I would say I always tell every single customer everything we do beforehand and not really the results. I’m not really like results driven. I’m more like, these are our inputs, right? Versus, cause if I tell you we’re going to do a hundred dollars in your first month and we don’t do that, maybe I did the same inputs as this branch of that brand, but it’s going to get different results. So as an agency, think for sure make it clear to the customer that there’s always going to be risk, right? There’s nothing guaranteed. And yeah, I’m always very upfront, very clear to everybody I talk to, even if like they’re not a customer, I’m always happy to help anybody. if.

We’re watching this email to just chat. Always feel free to message me because I truly believe there’s like no secret sauce. There’s just you being really early to something, which I think obviously TikTok shop is early, but there’s certain markets inside TikTok shops. So I would say a certain market inside TikTok shop is live selling because in my opinion, the people that buy on lives don’t really buy on videos.

Moritz Schröder (50:25.052)
Yeah, I totally agree. I think we’re going to see a lot more agencies really specialize in certain niches, make sure that they completely dominate those niches and hopefully get so far ahead that they really differentiate themselves from other more generic agencies that are going to be out there as well. So I think.

We’re going to see a lot more agencies diving into the science that social commerce is and all the different aspects, all the different pillars. That’s what excites me about it, that there are so many factors that are.

crucial to make this work and you can tweak all the different numbers and see how that affects your end result. It’s going to be an exciting year ahead of us and I for one, I’m super excited to see where social commerce will develop to.

Alvaro – Viralux Media (51:23.63)
Yeah, it’s interesting because looking at it from the aspect of AI and how like now they’re like with lovable and AI and just now being able to maybe like start advertising on chat GPT right? Because now it’s giving you a confirmation, stuff like that. listened to the operators podcast. They were saying that they think that in the near future, you will have a AI avatar that will do like the basic shopping for you, which is very interesting because if that’s true, then

TikTok shop is not really needed no more because now you have an AI avatar of your brain and knows what you want. So it just buys everything that it knows that you want if you’re able to, obviously. Very interesting to see how like the world is going to change with AI because I think right now we’re in an interesting time that things are going to be changing a lot. mean, just six months ago, I was not using AI. I’ll just make that very clear. I was very against AI. I was very organic. was like, people need to use their creativity to actually succeed on TikTok shop specifically.

Now I use AI every single day. If I’m not using AI, it’s pretty weird. So it’s very interesting to see how it’s going to be the next six months, because the world is changing. And it’s kind of scary sometimes to think about.

Moritz Schröder (52:28.251)
Yeah, certainly. And I for one think that we might reach a point where you see AI fatigue with the consumers, with the people who are also consuming content. I think that’s already starting to happen. You see a lot of people complain about AI slop. At the same time, it’s very hard to even tell what is AI slop at this point.

videos are so good and so engaging. And even if there are AI, oftentimes I still watch them till the end because it’s so engaging and people who create those videos, of course, know what they’re doing and they crack the formula. So they’re just churning this stuff out, seeing what resonates with people. It’s gonna be super wild to see how all of that pays out.

Alvaro – Viralux Media (52:59.982)
Exactly.

Alvaro – Viralux Media (53:16.812)
Yes, for sure. Interesting.

Moritz Schröder (53:17.414)
Alvaro, where can people find you? What’s the best way to get in contact with you if they want to work together with you?

Alvaro – Viralux Media (53:25.772)
Yeah, so I’m on LinkedIn. It’s Avaro Quintero. Then on any other social media, I’m Avaro Creates. And yeah, feel free to message me. But even if you don’t want to work with me, just leave a chat.

Moritz Schröder (53:37.702)
Awesome. Thanks for coming on, man. It was a pleasure.

Alvaro – Viralux Media (53:40.782)
Thank you, Moritz.